Feb 062011

Last Monday evening, BBC2 broadcast a Horizon programme with the title Science Under Attack. Both the title and the content of the programme were deeply misleading but, no doubt unintentionally, it may reveal far more about the scientific establishments confused and panic-stricken reaction to the onslaught of criticism that it has witnessed since the Climategate scandal broke just over a year ago than either its illustrious presenter or the programme makers realise or intended.

The white knight who galloped to the rescue of our beleaguered ‘community of climate scientists’ (the presenter’s words) was Sir Paul Nurse, a Nobel Prize winning geneticist and the newly appointed president of the Royal Society. His rather blokeish, seemingly modest, but relentlessly confident and avuncular style in front of the camera, together with a gift for appearing to explain complex issues in a fair-minded and easily digestible way, were more than enough to lull any audience into a complacent acceptance of anything he might have to say. So what went wrong?

Sir Paul’s primary mission was to persuade viewers that the questions posed by global warming sceptics are of no consequence, and that climate science has emerged from a traumatic year of unsavoury revelations without a stain on its good name. But there was another theme that underpinned his thesis: everyone should listen to what scientists say and then meekly accept it as incontrovertible truth. Whether his efforts were appropriate for a scientist of his distinction is very doubtful. It is not unreasonable for the public to expect the president of our national academy of science to take a well-balanced view of such an important subject as climate change, but there was absolutely no evidence of this.

The Royal Society recently attempted to dump its indefensible claims that the science of anthropogenic global warming is settled and the debate is over by drafting a new, and far more cautious, report on the present level of scientific understanding of this vexed topic. It would appear that their new president has no such doubts or concerns about the vast uncertainties that dog climate research. One wonders just how much Sir Paul knows about the present state of play in climate science, which is well outside his field of expertise. It would also be interesting to know how he has informed himself about this subject.

This Horizon programme would seem to have been part of a concerted PR campaign that was launched soon after compromising emails from the Climate Research Unit at the University of East Anglia were released on the Internet. The narrative that the scientific community, and it’s cheerleaders in the eNGOs, the government, and parts of the media seek to implant in the public consciousness is that the scientists whose behaviour was laid bare in their correspondence were in fact innocent victims of politically motivated and unscrupulous climate sceptics, rather than the perpetrators of apparently disgraceful behaviour. This is to turn logic on its head, but if Nurse has noticed, eminent scientist that he no doubt is, then he sees no reason to comment.

For all his ‘man of the people’ delivery, one could hardly accuse Sir Paul of false modesty. Only seconds into his presentation, we were informed that “science created our modern world”, a fatuous and arrogant claim that seems to be emerging as a new mantra from the beleaguered science community.  Professor Brian Cox used almost the same phrase in his Wheldon lecture last December “science … delivered the modern world” while attempting to justify the BBC’s lack of impartiality when reporting climate related matters.

If this is the way that scientists are now inclined to see themselves, and an endorsement of that notion from such an eminent personage as the president of the Royal Society would certainly seem to send a message that it is quite OK to do so, then that is truly terrifying. Are scientists really so hubristic now that they ignore the contributions of philosophers, engineers, businessmen, explorers, academics from a host of non-scientific disciplines, social reformers, entrepreneurs, politicians, and countless others in order to assign all accolades and glory to themselves?

A few moments later, we were treated to a clip of Sir Paul barking, ‘Are you saying that the whole community, or a majority of the community of climate scientists are skewing their data? Is that what you are saying?’ at a rather startled looking James Delingpole. The camera immediately cut away giving the impression that the redoubtable ‘Dellers’ had no response to this salvo, which seems unlikely. Not many sceptics think anything of the kind, although they are well used to hearing the worst kind of climate alarmist, who is clutching at straws, making this accusation. Why the president of the Royal Society should choose to use such a notoriously threadbare ‘straw man’ argument without allowing a reply from his victim is something that each of us must decide for ourselves. And this sets the scene for most of the rest of the programme in which Sir Paul’s views are paramount, and the arguments of climate sceptics the attackers of the programme title are not given any serious consideration.

The message that Sir Paul evidently wishes to get across and there can be no doubt that this edition of Horizon was about getting a very specific message across and doing so ruthlessly was not particularly complex. If a Nobel Prize winner chooses to lay down the law on a matter as important as global warming, there is no room for dissent from anyone outside the cosy academic world of the scientific establishment that he inhabits. The views of an acclaimed researcher, albeit in a totally unrelated field, who is the new head of the world’s oldest and arguably most respected scientific institution, and by his own estimation a creator of the modern world, are beyond criticism or challenge because they represent SCIENCE. Particularly, no one should pay any attention to the questions that global warming sceptics pose because they are not part of the SCIENTIFIC ESTABLISHMENT and must therefor be politically motivated troublemakers. In this scenario there are legions of impartial and scrupulously fair-minded mainstream climate scientists queuing up to explain everything, while the sceptics just cause trouble.

As examples of such worthy personages, it is remarkable that Sir Paul chose to interview a very complacent glaciologist from James Hansen’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS) at NASA who seemed to have a less than adequate understanding of the carbon cycle and, believe it or not, Phil Jones, the researcher at the centre of the University of East Anglia Climategate scandal.

The man from NASA had some very pretty video presentations to show how satellites collect vast quantities of data about Earth’s climate, and how weather models can mimic observed data. No mention was made of the relatively short period that satellite data covers, or that GSMs that can predict weather patterns over a period of days with reasonable accuracy are not necessarily capable of telling us much about what the climate is likely to do during the rest of this century. A brief excursion into the carbon cycle lead to this amazing exchange:

Bob Bindschadler [NASA scientist]: We know how much fossil fuel we take out of the ground. We know how much we sell. We know how much we burn. And that is a huge amount of carbon dioxide. It’s about seven gigatons per year right now.

Paul Nurse: And is that enough to explain…?

Bob Bindschadler: Natural causes only can produce – yes, there are volcanoes popping off and things like that, and coming out of the ocean, only about one gigaton per year. So there’s just no question that human activity is producing a massively large proportion of the carbon dioxide.

Paul Nurse: So seven times more.

Bob Bindschadler: That’s right.

So it would appear that neither the NASA expert, nor the president of the Royal Society who has chosen to enlighten the public about the climate debate in an hour long TV programme, know that anthropogenic emissions of Co2 are generally estimated as about 5% of natural emissions into the atmosphere, not 700%.

However Sir Paul did confide, rather breathlessly, that GISS burns $2bn (no it’s not a typo) in funding for climate research each year, rather implying that any data that cost that much must be pretty darned good. The possibility that funding on this scale might be a distinct disincentive to following up on any evidence that casts doubt on anthropogenic global warming (AGW) seems not to have crossed the presenter’s mind. This is strange as, at other points in the programme, Sir Paul stresses the importance of scientists considering all the evidence relating to the research they are conducting and to testing their theories to destruction. As his programme appears to be an exercise in assessing the credibility of climate scepticism in face of the wisdom handed down by the creators of the modern world, one might expect him to follow his own excellent advice so far as methodology is concerned. It would seem that he reserves such good practices for the day job in the genetics lab.

Concerning the availability of research funding to those concerned about the climate, there is a deep irony in the fact that the Horizon programme was broadcast about the same  time that Jeff Id, who has made a valuable, and sceptical, contribution to the climate debate, announced that he was closing his Air Vent blog because of business and family pressures, and Antony Watts of Watts Up With That took a decision to scale back his activities for similar reasons.

The sceptics that Professor Nurse chooses to interview, supposedly to find out what evidence climate scepticism is founded on, are James Delingpole and Fred Singer.

The former is a journalist who happily admits that he is an arts graduate who only became interested in the climate debate about a year ago, and that he can hardly be expected to be a match for a scientist of Nurse’s standing. Fred Singer, now in his mid-eighties, was introduced as ‘one of the world’s most prominent and prolific climate sceptics’ and interviewed in a crowded and very noisy Washington diner where a few mumbled remarks about solar influence on climate were hardly audible, but gave the impression as the film makers presumably intended that he was talking nonsense.  Of the multitude of climate sceptics who could have presented arguments that Sir Paul would have had trouble sweeping aside, there was no sign, but then we were not watching that kind of programme and he was not considering all the evidence or testing his theories to destruction on this occasion.

The interview with Phil Jones, on the other hand, was conducted in the tranquil setting of the CRU library and the University or East Anglia campus, where not a syllable of the Climategate emailers responses to sympathetically posed leading questions could be missed.  This was an obvious attempt to rehabilitate this still beleaguered scientist, but why should Sir Paul want to do such a thing when doubts about both Jones behaviour and his research findings still so obviously exist?  The day after the programme was broadcast, the House of Commons Select Committee on Science and Technology published their review of the supposedly independent inquiries into the Climategate affair. They found that the inquiries were not independent, and that they failed to examine issues that could have proved damaging to Jones and his colleagues.

What is perhaps rather strange is that, while giving Jones and the University of East Anglia such an easy time, and claiming that the Climategate emailers have been exonerated by ‘independent’ enquiries even though these just happen to have been set up by their employers, the very institutions that would suffer most if any malfeasance had been reported, Sir Paul omits to mention that he was born (and bred :correction, see below) in the city of Norwich, where UEA is based, and that he received his PhD from UEA in 1973. Nor does he mention that Jones was a part of the Society’s climate advisory network that produced the now discredited and replaced statement on climate change referred to above. Given the degree of mistrust that exists between warmists and sceptics, those would seem to be matters that he should have been quite open about.

There is much more that one could say about this programme which, while purporting to be a dispassionate analysis of the climate debate by an eminent scientist, is just another shocking attempt to influence public opinion by being very selective in the evidence it considers. Instead of reviewing the criticisms, or in the words of the programme title ‘attacks’, that climate research has been subject to, Nurse prefers to home in on a very mild criticism that comes from those within the establishment fold who seek to defend the scientists.

Scientists may not be willing enough to publicly discuss the uncertainties in their science, or to fully engage with those that disagree with them, and this has helped to polarise the debate.

The hostile and arrogant attitude of climate scientists to anyone who may be so impertinent as to want to ask questions about their findings were displayed for all to see in the  Climategate emails. Engaging with those who disagree with them and acknowledging uncertainties will not prevent a polarised debate, it will simply bring an increased deluge of embarrassing questions from sceptics, and climate scientists must know this. But the suggestion that climate scientists may merely have been a little bit reticent sounds benign and reassuring to the uninitiated when delivered with a steady gaze looking straight into the lens of the camera. The problem is that if the uncertainties that attend every step on the way to an anthropogenic climate change hypothesis were frankly discussed, then the credibility of climate science would vanish like snowdrifts in a heatwave. Too many unjustified claims of certainty or near certainty have been made in the past for researchers to publicise the true state of affairs now.

But if all else fails, one can always blame the media for any woes. This seems to be a very strange line for Sir Paul to take. In an age when ‘churnalism’ (journalists regurgitating undigested press releases, stories from wire services, and PR packages without checking them) assures any sensational story about imminent environmental catastrophe a place in the headlines it is hard to know what climate scientists have to complain about. But Sir Paul says:

It’s not surprising that the public are confused reading all of this different stuff. There’s these lurid headlines and there’s political opinions, I think, filtering through, which probably reflects editorial policy within the newspapers, and we get an unholy mix of the media and the politics, and it’s distorting the proper reporting of science. And that’s a real danger for us, if science is to have its proper impact on society.

He seems to  be referring to the Daily Express, Daily Mail and Sunday Telegraph where climate scepticism is freely reported, but not of course to the Guardian, the Independent, and very often the Times and Sunday Times, which seem to be prepared to print any scare story about ‘new scientific research’, however ill founded and preposterous it might be. And Sir Paul certainly doesn’t address what Steve McIntyre has called ‘the silence of the lambs’: the failure of the climate science community to criticise or correct inaccurate and exaggerated reporting when it stirs up alarm about human impact on the climate.

Indeed there are moments of pure unreality in Sir Paul’s diatribe against those who attack science.

There’s an overwhelming body of evidence that says we are warming our planet. But complexity allows for confusion, and for alternative theories to develop. The only solution is to look at all the evidence as a whole. I think some extreme sceptics decide what to think first and then cherry-pick the data to support their case.

Of course the possibility that climate scientists might be victims of precisely the same affliction is not addressed. As for the so-called consensus view of climate science, he has this to say:

“Consensus” can be used like a dirty word. Consensus is actually the position of the experts at the time, and if it’s working well – it doesn’t always work well – but if it’s working well, they evaluate the evidence. You make your reputation in science by actually overturning that, so there’s a lot of pressure to do it. But if over the years the consensus doesn’t move, you have to wonder: is the argument, is the evidence against the consensus good enough?

It is this utterance, perhaps more than anything else in the programme, which suggests that Sir Paul is way out of his depth where climate science is concerned. The idealised scenario that he proposes may be possible in mathematics, chemistry, physics or genetics, but in climate research it would be professional suicide, as the Climategate emails show. In this field, if no other, dissent is viewed as heresy pure and simple, regardless of how well founded it might be.

And while we are on the subject of the scientific consensus on climate change, it is very strange that Sir Paul has omitted any mention of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change from this programme about the inviolable authority of climate science. I wonder why?

Controversy surrounding AIDs and GM crops are touched on briefly, but the programme’s focus is relentlessly on climate change. A sequence dealing with aids includes a long, and very sympathetic, discussion with a man called Tony who does not believe that HIV causes AIDs because, although he was diagnosed HIV positive years ago, and has not taken any of the medication he was prescribed, he is still alive and apparently healthy. This would seem to have been included for no other purpose than to suggest that climate sceptics are no different from HIV sceptics, and therefor totally irrational.

Controversy about GM food crops is also given a brief airing, but Sir Paul seems to be oblivious to the irony that the green activists who trash fields of GM maize, and therefore science must be scientific ignoramuses because they do not listen when researchers say there is no danger, are likely to be the very same people who will turn out for anti fossil fuel demonstrations and presumably fully accept all that the climate science community has to say on that subject.

This episode of Horizon begins and ends in the archives of the Royal Society with Sir Paul admiring – almost worshiping – the early minutes of the Royal Society’s meetings and works by Newton and Darwin. No one can doubt the outstanding record of scientific achievement of the Society in the past, and Sir Paul is obviously thrilled to be at its head, but the inclusion of these sequences seem to say to the audience, don’t you dare question what I, the successor of these great men, am telling you.

In the eyes of many scientists, it seems to be becoming as unacceptable to challenge scientific dogma today as it was to question the theology of the medieval church, although it is not yet quite so dangerous. Yet anyone who has read the Climategate emails must know that in climate science a reformation is long overdue: this branch of science definitely needs a spring-clean. In the emails we see a world of people whose sole preoccupation seems not to be curiosity and discovery, but keeping one jump ahead of their critics. And how do they view those critics? As politically motivated ignoramuses of course, while Sir Paul describes, the CRU in the following terms:

‘The unit’s headquarters are [sic] tiny, yet Dr Jones and his colleagues have had a truly global impact’.

Why should such titans of the scientific world be concerned about sceptics who want to check their research? What could they possibly have to fear? And why, in the wake of the Climategate scandal, did the University of East Anglia promise a review of the research that has come out of the CRU, and then quietly drop the idea? And why is asking questions about such matters considered to be an attack on science?  Indeed why, if there isn’t any problem really, has such controversy triggered an hour-long programme from the BBC starring the president of our national academy of science?

No one could possibly expect the scientific world’s new chief representative (and shop steward?) to say anything that might stand in the way of concern about global warming providing billions of pounds of research funding, but the subject did deserve something rather better than a tedious and often confused defence of the establishment view; just leave it all to the scientists Sir Paul seems to be repeating endlessly, like Phil Jones, who understand all these things and cannot possibly be wrong.

But how can any fair-minded person, inside or outside the scientific establishment, be indifferent to demands that climate scientist, who have so much influence on public policy at present, should be subject to intense scrutiny, and particularly by those who are most hostile to their views. Only then can their research findings be fully tested and finally trusted. Although Sir Paul says he is keen on scientists testing their ideas to destruction, he seems terrified if that process is instigated from outside the scientific establishment and applied to climate science. And therein lies the real thrust of his programme.

Sir Paul is now at the pinnacle of the scientific establishment. His views on climate science matter, regardless of whether he really knows anything about the controversies that have engulfed this subject or not. Although he purports to be considering whether the attacks that have been made on climate science during the last year can in any way be justified, it seems evident that his mind was closed to any such possibility from the outset. Had this not been the case he would have chosen very different climate sceptics to talk to and would have attempted to establish just what their concerns are.

The title of the programme, Science Under Attack, points to a fascinating sidelight on the way that the scientific establishment now view the climate debate. As I have said, what controversy exists over GM crops and the cause of AIDs is of a very different type and order from that concerning anthropogenic global warming, and their inclusion in this programme is ancillary to the main theme. So far as I am aware, mathematicians, physicists, chemists and astronomers are not conspicuously under attack. Only climate science and climate scientists are in the cross hairs of public condemnation at the moment. So why was this programme called Science Under Attack? Is this meant to imply that anyone who fails to embrace the consensus view on climate change is challenging science, and the scientific method, in its entirety? If so that would seem to be a very dangerous position for Sir Paul and the scientific establishment to adopt.

If the Royal Society is prepared hold up climate science as the poster child of science as a whole, then the credibility of science is being linked to just one discipline that has a distinctly short and chequered record. This leads to two serious pitfalls. In the first, the old established disciplines maths, physics, chemistry, astronomy etc are likely to resent the hype and razzmatazz surrounding their junior colleagues, and become hostile and inquisitive. It would seem unlikely that climate science would come out of such scrutiny by other disciplines smelling of roses.

The second is that the public may come to judge science as a whole by the performance and behaviour of one high profile discipline; climate science. This would seem to be a most ill advised and offering a hostage to fortune. At the moment the frenetic revelations of last year have quietened down, but it would be quite unjustified to assume that all the skeletons have tumbled out of the climate science cupboard and that more will not follow.

Added to these considerations, it seems that criticism is something that the scientific establishment now finds impossible to cope with in an open and constructive way. Hence the rather hysterical title of Sir Paul’s programme and its utter failure to acknowledge and address the origin of the problems that climate scepticism are causing to those who seek to promote and defend science. As I have said, it would be unreasonable to expect the president of the Royal Society to express any outright scepticism about global warming in a popular television series, but one might expect him to acknowledge that doubts exist when it is so manifestly obvious that uncertainties in the science have not been acknowledged in the past. In fact, he does no more than acknowledge that some uncertainties exist, but in a dismissive way that suggests that this need worry no one.

There are various possible explanations for this obtuse behaviour.

It is of course possible that Sir Paul is simply being disingenuous, but this would seem unlikely. Then there is the possibility that, when assessing a controversy in a discipline that he is not familiar with, he has been credulous and willing to retail uncritically the views of his cronies in the scientific establishment. But perhaps the most likely explanation, based on Sir Paul’ own words, is that an overweening arrogance has seized the world of science. Here is part of Sir Paul’s peroration:

I’m here in the Royal Society,[which represents]  350 years of an endeavour which is built on respect for observation, respect for data, respect for experiment. Trust no-one, trust only what the experiments and the data tell you. We have to continue to use that approach, if we are to solve problems such as climate change.

It’s become clear to me that if we hold to these ideals of trust in evidence, then we have a responsibility to publicly argue our case. Because in this conflicted and volatile debate, scientists are not the only voices that are listened to. When a scientific issue has important outcomes for society, then the politics becomes increasingly more important. So if we look at this issue of climate change, that is particularly significant. Because that has effects on how we manage our economy and manage our politics. And so this is become a crucially political matter, and we can see that by the way that the forces are being lined up on both sides. What really is required here is a focus on the science, keeping the politics and keeping the ideologies out of the way.(Emphasis added)

This would appear to be a plea for acceptance of scientific hegemony on a scale that brooks no dissent, but at the same time it is contradictory. The climate sceptics who precipitated the Climategate scandal were, in fact, attempting to establish that trust in the experiments and data is justified. Why hinder them?  Concern that only the voices of science should be listened to from someone with Sir Paul Nurse’s influence sit very uneasily with the plea that the evidence for AGW is overwhelming. If this is the case, what does scientific establishment have to fear? And anyway, why should the voice of climate science be unchallengeable? As for the importance of not trusting anyone other than climate scientists when assessing the evidence of AGW, it is necessary for most of us to do so, and not least the audience that has spent an hour soaking up Sir Paul’s anything but objective views on the climate controversy, even though he is a geneticist. Is the title ‘scientist’ really enough to convey the ability to pontificate on any branch of science with authority?

Finally lets look at what a couple of commentators who can definitely not be described as climate sceptics had to say about Science Under Attack. Here is Fiona Fox of the Science Media Centre, one of the most influential climate alarm advocates, writing on the BBC College of Journalism website :

Many, including colleagues in the science communication world, felt that it [Nurse’s programme] was a classic example of ‘scientism’, a growing tendency to demand that science should trump everything else as the only sound basis for good public debate and decision-making.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/journalism/blog/2011/02/when-does-the-vigorous-defence.shtml

And Mike Hulme, former director the Tyndall Centre at the University of East Anglia

In this programme from BBC’s Horizon team, the incoming President of the Royal Society, Sir Paul Nurse, offers a vigorous defence of the trustworthiness of science. He also reveals an exalted view of the normative authority of science: both in the world of political decision-making (e.g. the cases of climate change and GM crops which the programme selects) and in the private lives of citizens. I suggest that he betrays an underlying adherence both to the linear view that science should drive policy-making and, to a lesser extent, to the deficit model of science communication.

http://mikehulme.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Science-under-attack.pdf

If concerns such as these are being expressed from the heart of the warmist community, then Sir Paul’s tenure at the Royal Society is likely to be an interesting one. As he acknowledges in Science Under Attack, public belief in anthropogenic global warming is steadily declining in spite of all the efforts by scientists, politicians, the eNGOs and a large part of the media. Evidently it is not enough for scientists to shout ever more kindly that they are right and everyone else is not only wrong, but is not even capable of having a valid opinion.

And so we finally return to the programme title: Science Under Attack. Is Sir Paul really saying that because climate scientists are being criticised, all science is being attacked and threatened? It would appear that he is, but choosing climatology as the champion and exemplar of science would seem to be illogical and very risky, so why do it? Does he really think that the reputation of scientists everywhere depends on the public image of climate scientists? He may be right, but if so, then the world of science risks being hopelessly compromised by any shortcomings that become evident in a field that is now mired in controversy and, as he admits in the programme, failing to convince the public that human activity is warming the planet.

Science has not been well served by Sir Paul’s programme. If he is right, and the image of science as a whole has suffered from the ructions in climatology over the last year, then the scientific establishment would be wise to cut climate science adrift before it inflicts any more damage on the rest of the profession. Instead, the science establishment seem to think that it can to shore up the reputation and authority of their profession with a blatantly partisan TV film fronted by a man who seems very proud to be following in the footsteps of Newton, Wren and Darwin.

H/t to Alex Cull for an excellent transcript of the programme, which can be found here.

(UPDATE 11/02/2011: I have corrected this post which originally said that Sir Paul was ‘born and bred’ in Norwich.  Although he was born in Norwich, he was brought up in London)

197 Responses to “Nurse puts science on life support”

  1. Peter Geany and TonyB

    Of course PeterM will NOT respond to PeterG’s challenge to provide specific studies by climate scientists, which refute the CERES and ERBE satellite observations of Spencer + Braswell or Lindzen + Choi, both of which showed that a doubling of CO2 would cause no more than around 0.6C warming (at equilibrium), and by extension, that AGW is no potential future threat to humanity.

    It is not PeterM’s method of operation to discuss climate science specifically (as he is fully aware that this would weaken his position as a supporter of the “dangerous AGW” postulation).

    So he waffles and squirms, changing topics like most folks change socks and shifting to “creationism vs. Darwinism” and other totally unrelated topics to avoid discussing the real topic.

    I have found that this type of behavior is typical for DAGW “believers”, like PeterM, so it’s really nothing unusual.

    It’s simply part of their defense mechanism.

    Max

  2. Peter G,

    You mention Richard Lindzen, who you’ll know is a Prof at MIT. If you Google terms like “climate change” and MIT , his is the name you’ll almost certainly see first.

    Yet, if look at MIT’s web page on climate change, you won’t find much mention of Prof Lindzen, and the content takes the same mainstream line as just about every other uni and research organisation in the world.

    If we look at a list of their research staff:

    http://globalchange.mit.edu/people/staff.php

    We can see those who must be responsible for the general tone that’s set at MIT. So it looks like , even within his own uni, Prof Lindzen is in a very small minority.

    They aren’t household names but they are, I would suggest, good examples of the people you’re asking about.

  3. PeterM You are clutching at straws and changing the topic because you can’t answer the question. Unless these unnamed people are prepared to stick their heads above the parapet, and I have seen no scientist that has challenged the position of Lindzen or Spencer having done their own research. I don’t care if it is published or not in one of the journals, it just has to be available with all the data so that it can be critiqued.

    I can only come to one conclusion as to why there is no challenge to Lindzen or Spencer; and that is because no one has done any research. There may be some computer modelling out there but we all know the models don’t and can’t reflect reality.

    Tell me Peter, did Paul Nurse get his Nobel prise for computer modelling, or was it real world of medicine? My daughters a Doctor and she has never mentioned computer modelling. Correct me if I’m wrong Peter but wasn’t Paul Nurses Nobel prise for medicine?

    And again I come back to the Fact that Paul Nurse has allowed himself to either be fatally manipulated, or he is doing the establishments bidding for them in the hope of transitioning to the establishment, or he is just plain stupid and his prise was simply right place at the right time.

  4. Peter Geany

    PeterM’s totally irrelevant latest waffle (152) confirmed what I wrote you and TonyB in 151:

    Of course PeterM will NOT respond to PeterG’s challenge to provide specific studies by climate scientists, which refute the CERES and ERBE satellite observations of Spencer + Braswell or Lindzen + Choi, both of which showed that a doubling of CO2 would cause no more than around 0.6C warming (at equilibrium), and by extension, that AGW is no potential future threat to humanity.

    I have never witnessed Peter getting specific on scientific topics since I have had exchanges with him on this site. It is simply not his “MO”.

    Waffle, side-step, change topic, waffle again: that is Peter’s MO, despite the fact that he claims to be a scientist, himself.

    At first I had difficulty figuring out WHY Peter avoided discussing specific scientific topics related to AGW.

    But I know now that it is because he knows, deep within, that the “science” supporting the “dangerous AGW” premise, to which he clings so religiously, is basically flawed, and it is simply too painful for him to face this directly.

    Max

  5. Max 154

    You are right of course with your analysis, but forgot to add in red herrings to your list. He produces more of those than a fisherman on a herring boat. Speaking of fishermen, I am still waiting to hear how Peter justifies SST’s taking pride of place as a global measure of temperature.

    I think it will be a long wait, and he still hasn’t answered any of the eight other questions I asked months ago.

    Tonyb

  6. PeterG,

    You say ” I have seen no scientist that has challenged the position of Lindzen or Spencer having done their own research.”

    You’ve not seen this?
    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2010/01/lindzen-and-choi-unraveled/

    or this?

    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/04/lindzen-point-by-point/

    There’s plenty more.

    If you haven’t seen – it’s because you haven’t looked

  7. PeterG,

    It could be that you’re right and Paul Nurse is ‘stupid’ as you put it. On the other hand he’s got a Nobel prize and it could well be that the stupidity lies elsewhere!

    http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/medicine/laureates/2001/nurse-autobio.html

  8. PeterM

    I have seen the RealClimate blog “Lindzen and Choi unraveled” by Fasullo et al., which you cite, but this is only a blog article, not a serious scientific rebuttal (of which there have been none).

    And if you read down the blog you will see that a blogger named H. Tuuri, after several exchanges with the “party faithful” (including one of the co-authors of the lead post), has confirmed the LC09 findings, based on a totally independent analysis of the raw ERBE data (comment 59):

    59
    H. Tuuri says:
    19 Jan 2010 at 1:05 PM

    Chris, I have now analyzed the monthly tropical (20 S – 20 N) data at http://earth-www.larc.nasa.gov/erbeweb/Edition3_Rev1/

    I imported the data to a free statistics program called OpenStat. Since I was not able to find a numeric table of the Reynolds and Smith OISST v2 product, I ‘digitized’ by hand the graph on page 8 of http://science.larc.nasa.gov/ceres/STM/2009-11/22_Wong_1109.pdf

    I used OpenStat to compute moving averages over 12 months (I used option ANALYSES -> Autocorrelation in OpenStat). With shorter moving averages, the NET flux graph contains too much noise, though the delta-SST graph is smooth also with shorter moving averages.

    I analyzed the 1986-1990 sequence of El Nino/La Nina, as well as the 1997-1999 massive El Nino.
    1) For the 1986-1990 event, the variation in the 12 month moving average of the NET flux is from 345 W/m^2 to 347 W/m^2. The variation of the 12 month moving average of delta-SST is -0.18 K to 0.16 K. We get:
    delta-NET flux / delta-SST = 2 W/m^2 per 0.34 K = 6 W/m^2 per K.
    2) For the 1997-1999 event, the 12 month moving average of the NET flux at the start of 1997 is 344 W/m^2. It rises to a local maximum of 345 W/m^2, and later spikes at 346 W/m^2. That is, even the 12 month smoothed Net flux is not smooth at all, but has a double maximum. The 12 month moving average of delta-SST rises from -0.03 K to +0.22 K. We get:
    delta-NET flux / delta-SST = 1 W/m^2 OR 2 W/m^2 (depending on which of the double maxima we choose)
    per 0.25 K = 4 W/m^2 OR 8 W/m^2 per K.
    Conclusion: we get results that agree with Lindzen and Choi in LC09. We had to use a very long moving average of 12 months to smooth the NET flux enough for our graphical analysis.

    I used OpenStat to compute also the regression between delta-SST and the transfer of heat from the Tropics to higher latitudes. The correlation coefficient is -0.005 and the slope is -0.32. That is, there is essentially no correlation. An El Nino event in the Tropics does not cause the transfer of heat to increase. That is, the extra heat from El Nino is handled locally in the Tropics.

    I will next do further research on the NET flux from 60 S to 60 N, and its correlation to HadCRUT3 monthly global temperature anomalies.

    I will check if I can repeat the results of Forster and Gregory:http://homepages.see.leeds.ac.uk/~earpmf/papers/ForsterandGregory2006.pdf
    The data and the programs that I used are available by email from me, if someone wants to repeat my calculations.

    Many of the “faithful” had challenged Tuuri before he completed his reanalysis, but none did so afterward, so it stands (as a confirmation of LC09 and an invalidation of the lead blog, which attempted to refute LC09).

    Another critique of LC09 was written by Spencer on his blog site.
    http://www.drroyspencer.com/2009/11/some-comments-on-the-lindzen-and-choi-2009-feedback-study/

    He critiques the calculation method and arrives at a slightly higher 2xCO2 climate sensitivity of 0.6C (rather than LC09’s 0.4C) using the ERBE data used by LC09..

    The second RealClimate blog you cite has nothing to do with LC09. It is all about a totally different paper by Lindzen. And, again, it’s a blog, not a serious scientific critique.

    There have been no critiques of Spencer & Braswell 2007 (another scientific study based on CERES satellite observations and showing negative net cloud feedback), nor of Spencer’s later (2010) blog article confirming a low climate sensitivity of around 0.5C:
    http://www.drroyspencer.com/2010/05/strong-negative-feedback-from-the-latest-ceres-radiation-budget-measurements-over-the-global-oceans/

    Come up with something real here, Peter.

    So far you haven’t.

    Max

  9. PeterM

    Nobody is calling Paul Nurse “stupid” (except you).

    He is obviously a brilliant scientist in his field, having won a Nobel Prize.

    He is also personally a very affable and politically astute character, and I supposed these may be reasons why he became head of RS.

    It is a shame, for him, for the RS and for the reputation of “science” in general, that he let himself be misused by BBC to sell a “political” story as “science” (and to get his facts screwed up in the process).

    This did not do him any good and it did not do the credibility of “climate science” any good. His performance became an embarrassment (which is why we are still discussing it here).

    But I really think we have beaten this topic to death (and besides, we are drifting).

    Max

  10. Max,

    Scientific papers aren’t quite written in the way you seem to suggest.

    If Lindzen claims that climate senistivity is one degree or less, whereas other authors say three degrees they don’t neccessarily mention Lindzen at all. Its a sort of snub by omission.

    But there are plenty of scientists who openly say he’s wrong.
    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/02/richard-lindzens-hol-testimony/
    Open Thread on Lindzen Op-Ed in WSJ
    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/04/gray-on-agw/
    http://www.giss.nasa.gov/edu/gwdebate/
    http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/2006/05/richard_lindzen_claims_global.php

  11. Max,

    Think of the program what you will, but it’s Paul Nurse telling us what he thinks from beginning to end. In the unlikley event that it ever does turn out he’s got it all wrong, he won’t be able to claim ‘misuse’ by the BBC. After all we both agree he’s smart enough to know exactly what he is doing.

  12. PeterM

    Opining that “someone is wrong” on a blog site, such as RealClimate carries no weight, Peter.

    If a scientific study is to be refuted, it must be done with another scientific paper, which shows how and why the method used or conclusions reached were incorrect.

    This has not yet occurred for Spencer & Braswell, or for Lindzen & Choi, as Peter Geany pointed out.

    Sorry.

    Keep hunting.

    Max

  13. PeterM

    Certainly I would agree with you that Paul Nurse cannot legally claim “misuse” by BBC, as no one forced him to say the things he did.

    It was just unfortunate for him that (as a honored scientist) he was put into the position of having to talk about a subject of which he had no knowledge and therefore made some silly mistakes.

    The fact that his counterpart was a skeptical columnist, rather than one of the many knowledgeable scientists active in the field, set the tone for the whole program.

    Had both the “pro” DAGW side as well as the “skeptic” side been represented by a knowledgeable climate scientist, who is active in the field today, possibly with Nurse acting as an impartial moderator, the discussion would have been more interesting (and less one-sided).

    But in a program it called “Science under Attack” it is obvious that BBC did not want both sides of story to be heard impartially.

    Max

  14. Look, there is no question of Paul Nurse being “put into a position”. If he didn’t agree with any or all of the programs content, or its title, he wouldn’t have done it.

    I remember reading but I can’t find the reference now that Paul Nurse feels scientists do have a duty to explain what they are doing and what science means generally. Coming down from the ivory tower so to speak.

    If the BBC hadn’t wanted to do the program he’d have just asked someone else.

  15. Max,

    You’re still not understanding how scientific papers work. It’s not usual for one paper to be written merely to disagree with a previous paper. If that were the case then scientists could build up their paper count by staging contrived disagreements on minor points.

    Furthermore, the citation count of any paper is used as a measure of its significance. If a particular paper is considered to be incorrect then it wouldn’t be desirable for a different author to mention that in a subsequent paper because that would involve giving it a citation.

    So an incorrect paper may be talked about and discussed in articles but they aren’t discussed in polite company!

    Them’s the rules of the game! Non scientists who are used to more robust political style debates may find these genteel habits a starnge concept, but that’s the way its always been done, in scientific circles, and its unlikely to change in the near future.

    Nevertheless, there have been several refutations of people like Lindzen. Unfortunately they are often only available behind paywall but this link shows Trenberths criticism of LC2009.

    http://climateprogress.org/2010/01/11/science-lindzen-debunked-again-positive-negative-feedbacks-clouds-tropics/

    The more politicised atmosphere surrounding the AGW topic certainly do seem to be eroding more polite habits. It’s not normal for scientists to use phrases like:

    “But, seriously, how could such crap make it into a serious journal?”

  16. PeterM

    I understand very well “how scientific papers work”. But from your comments, it appears that you do not.

    We have two recent papers, both published in scientific journals, both based on actual physical observations (from ERBE and CERES satellites), and both pointing toward a relatively “insensitive” and “stable” climate, with a 2xCO2 climate sensitivity well below 1C. These are Spencer & Braswell and Lindzen and Choi.

    There have been no papers published in scientific journals, which refute or invalidate these findings with new physically observed data.

    Trenberth’s (or Fasulo’s) blog post in Climate Progress (or RealClimate) are simply blog articles. Not papers published in scientific journals. These are nice, but do not carry the weight of serious studies published in a scientific journal. That’s how the “scientific process works”, Peter.

    In fact, there are no published studies based on actual physical observations, of which I am aware, which demonstrate a climate sensitivity of 3.2C (on average), as assumed by all the climate models cited by IPCC.

    Let’s say that the “null hypothesis” for the premise that AGW is a potential danger is 2xCO2<2C.

    IOW if the 2xCO2 climate impact is below 2.0C, there is no potential danger from AGW, as there is not enough carbon in all the fossil fuels of our planet to ever reach significant (and certainly not dangerous) warming over today.

    Is long as there are no studies based on physical observations, which would falsify this null hypothesis, “dangerous AGW” remains a nice, uncorroborated hypothesis, but nothing much to worry about.

    After 25 years of AGW concern and active work in the scientific community, it has still not been possible for anyone to falsify the “null hypothesis” I just outlined. No scientific studies have been able to show empirical data to support the “dangerous AGW”. hypothesis.

    And that is the key weakness both Peter Geany and I have been posting about all along, which you have as yet been able to refute.

    Max

  17. Typo: last sentence ahould be:

    …which you have as yet NOT been able to refute.

  18. Max,

    There have been a number of studies that calculate climate sensitivity directly from empirical observations, independent of models.

    Lorius 1990 examined Vostok ice core data and calculates a range of 3 to 4°C.
    Hoffert 1992 reconstructs two paleoclimate records (one colder, one warmer) to yield a range 1.4 to 3.2°C.
    Hansen 1993 looks at the last 20,000 years when the last ice age ended and empirically calculates a climate sensitivity of 3 ± 1°C.
    Gregory 2002 used observations of ocean heat uptake to calculate a minimum climate sensitivity of 1.5.
    Chylek 2007 examines the period from the Last Glacial Maximum to Holocene transition. They calculate a climate sensitivy range of 1.3°C and 2.3°C.
    Tung 2007 performs statistical analysis on 20th century temperature response to the solar cycle to calculate a range 2.3 to 4.1°C.
    Bender 2010 looks at the climate response to the 1991 Mount Pinatubo eruption to constrain climate sensitivity to 1.7 to 4.1°C.

  19. This should be interesting to watch, as picked up by Judith Curry’s Climate Etc. blog:
    http://judithcurry.com/2011/03/17/uk-scitech-peer-review-enquiry/#more-2708

    The UK House of Commons Select Committee on Science and Technology has launched an inquiry into peer review:
    http://www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/science-and-technology-committee/news/110127-new-inquiry—peer-review/

    Let’s hope this does not just get so watered down that climate science hardly gets mentioned or end up being another whitewash led by the “consensus” group.

    The inquiry really needs to get into the dual problem that many scientists fear exists in “peer review” in climate science today (even if Paul Nurse may not be aware of this yet, as it is so far removed from his own field of scientific expertise):
    – allowing flawed papers to slip through if they support the “consensus” view
    – censoring out papers or data, which do not support the “consensus” view

    Let’s hope we get some clarity here and not just more cover-up.

    Max

  20. PeterM

    You cite some published studies (168), which you claim provide empirical data to support the notion of an inherently sensitivy climate with high 2xCO2 climate sensitivity.

    Let’s go through these.

    Lorius 1990, Hoffert 1992 and Hansen 1993 are based on paleo-climate reconstructions, which are notoriously inaccurate and can tell you anything you want them to, so forget these. These are not based on empirical data.

    The others are computer model studies, with a bit of physically observed data as partial input. Let me explain:

    Tung 2007 performs statistical analysis on 20th century temperature response to the solar cycle to calculate a range 2.3 to 4.1°C.

    The authors concluded that from solar minimum to maximum from 1996 to 2001, the forcing from the sun increased global temperatures by 0.18°C, with a similar decrease from 2001 to 2007.

    Spencer has addressed this study, pointing out flaws in the assumptions made
    http://www.drroyspencer.com/2010/06/low-climate-sensitivity-estimated-from-the-11-year-cycle-in-total-solar-irradiance/

    In his analysis of the same data cited by Tung and ignoring the possibility of any Svensmark-type mechanism of cloud modulation by the solar cycle, Spencer arrives at a 2xCO2 CS of 1.7°C. Of course, if any Svensmark effect were there, the number would be even lower, as the study is based on the assumption that the sun only has an influence on our climate through measurable changes in direct solar irradiation.

    So we have too many unknowns to arrive at a meaningful conclusion.

    Bender 2010 looks at the climate response to the 1991 Mount Pinatubo eruption. http://www.misu.su.se/~frida/benderetal10.pdf
    A temperature change was observed and this was attributed to Mt. Pinatubo. Then the ratio between temperature perturbation and the TOA observed shortwave flux perturbation was used to calculate a 2xCO2 climate sensitivity.

    The attribution of the observed temperature change to Mt. Pinatubo is fully arbitrary. There have been many unexplained up and down swings of temperature (most notably the unexplained lack of warming of the most recent decade). If only half of the observed change had really been caused by Mt. Pinatubo, the 2xCO2 climate sensitivity would have been only half of the suggested value.

    The change in TOA SW radiation could have been caused by Mt. Pinatubo partially, but also partially by increased cloud cover caused by other natural factors. To assume that it was all a result of the Mt. Pinatubo effect is a leap of faith. Again, an error in the assumptions would have led to an error in the conclusions, as well.

    The conclusion of the report rests on arguments from ignorance (“we can only explain it if we assume…”), and is therefore very questionable.

    I’d say that the papers you cited are interesting, but they do not provide empirical data based on physical observations, which support the notion of highly positive net overall feedbacks, leading to a 2xCO2 climate sensitivity significantly above 1°C, yet there are many physical observations, such as the early 20th century warming prior to significant increase in CO2, the recorded Greenland warming of the 1920s and 1930s reported by Chylek,
    http://www.joelschwartz.com/pdfs/Chylek.pdf

    the increase in total LW + SW TOA outgoing radiation observed by ERBE satellites with warming over the tropics reported by LC09, the increase in outgoing SW radiation from clouds with warming over the tropics observed by CERES satellites reported by SB07, etc.

    The climate models assume one thing but the empirical evidence is on the side of a relatively insensitive climate with a 2xCO2 CS of around 1°C, rather than a highly sensitive climate as postulated by Hansen and others with a 2xCO2 CS of around 2.0°C to 4.5°C.

    Max

  21. Max,

    I think we’ve agreed in the past that the effect of CO2 on temperature rise is logarithmic. So CO2 has risen since pre-industrial times by approximately 40% so this means that we’re nearly half way there in logarithmic terms.

    So also I think we’ve agreed that all the non CO2 factors just about cancel each other out. CH4, particulates etc.

    So if we just multiply the measured rise, over land and ocean, since pre-industrial times by 2.1, we do get 0.75 x 2.1 = 1.6deg C, which is somewhat higher than your estimate.

    If we multiply the measured rise over land , which is where most numans live you get 1 x 2.1 = 2.1 degC

    Why has the land warmed faster than the land? I’ll leave that question as an exercie for the student!

    A why do the IPCC say 3 degs is a more likely figure?

  22. Sorry it shot off again before I was ready!

    The last line should be: And why do the IPCC say, even if that 3 degs C is a more likely eventual figure for the total warming? Again another exercise for the student.

    You might not agree with them but at least it will pay you know their line of reasoning and who knows , you may even come up with a valid reason why it might be incorrect!

  23. Peter

    Pre industrial times is generally condidered to be the period prior to the latter part of the 18th century.

    Are you claiming that;

    A) We know an accurate global temperature from that time?
    B) That the whole of any temperature rise since is entirely due to mans emissions of Co2?
    C) In effect you are saying that it was man that brought us out of the LIA and that natural variability has played no part

    Did you really mean to say that?

    tonyb.

  24. PeterG,

    My last post to Max reminded me that Prof Lindzen once claimed that we were 75% of the way there – in terms of a doubling of CO2! And Lindzen isn’t an idiot – he knows this is just plain wrong. We’re about 40% of the way there in linear terms and 48% of the way in logarithmic terms.

    He’s just playing the fact that the public probably doesn’t know this. I don’t see any other possible conclusion except that Lindzen was trying to deceive his audience.

    Max will claim that the only possible way to refute people like Lindzen is to write a scientific paper about it. Really? For just a few seconds work tapping numbers into a calculator?

  25. TonyB,

    I’m not sure it worth arguing about what happened before 1850 or even 1900. Emissions of CO2 were very low then.

    Just take it from 1950 if you like.

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